If Christopher Hitchens and Anne Applebaum are both sternly against something, you can be pretty sure it has merit. In this instance, the Archbishop of Canterbury has clumsily advanced the notion that perhaps civil and family law ought to belong to cultural communities. Hitchenbaum rises like a river trout to a well-cast fly: "He wants us in chains! Dhimmitude!" it cries. True, the hows and whens of Rowan Williams not-quite-a-plan-but-a-suggestion remain a little nebulous, but I frankly endorse his ends. Why, after all, shouldn't we join some kind of actually consensual community, say on a contractual basis for periods of limited duration? Hitchens in the highest dander that his five-decade hangover will allow without rupturing an eyeball, screams that a lot of North-London Hasidim arbitrate their own breaches of contract and trust, presumably based on Talmudic principle. Well, why not, if the parties mutually agree to independent arbitrage, why not? Remove the Jew element, which is what Hitchens is really hollering about, and what you have is a perfectly ordinary business practice, the sort of thing that happens every day between parties that wish to arbitrate, mediate, and adjudicate disputes outside of the courts.
To the extent possible, all human relationships ought to be volunatry. Most of us agree on this point in the abstract; it isn't only a libertarian totem. Yet in practice almost no one can abide it, and will argue that it is far more sensical to gather 10, 15, 50, 500 million human beings under a system of uniform "justice," which will be applicable to and desirable for all.
UPDATE: A complementary take on the same.
Tuesday, February 12, 2008
My Own Court in My Own Castle
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12 comments:
Yours is more theoretically tight, I suppose, but I still like mine better. Blog posts, that is.
The problem with cutouts for communities is what does that really mean? What is a community? Since I am a suspicious stateist as opposed to an anarchist, I have issues with this concept. In Medieval Europe, those under Holy Orders were immune to the civil government, such as it was. To what extent do we really want to allow the revisiting of that experience whether for Islamic Divorce, the licensing of Kosher delis or the proverbial dispensation for drunken Irish guys from DWI laws on those days adjacent to March 17. It's a community-cultural thing.
As a firm believer in devolution of human culture, I really am reluctant to consider allowing the Sharia's nose under the camel's ass or something along those lines.
We have a system like this already in the US -- tribal courts and tribal laws in the US. Not terribly effective, but very "community" based. If AXE and IOZ are injured by a tribal entity -- employment cases are most common, but there are others -- as a couple of pasty-faced white guys we have no legal recourse. The tribe will claim "sovereignty" and not honor the suit in a state or federal court unless the tribe itself or the federal law expressly says that they will. Tribes are exempt from some of the damndest things, of course...ADA, FMLA, EEO and so on. We have no standing to sue in tribal courts unless we are tribal members. However, it damn well better be the tribe of which we are members. A Sioux trying to gain redress in an Apache court will probably be told that they have no standing.
Extreme case? Of course. I don't think the meaningless Archbishop meant to allow stoning on the Salisbury Plain. But, unless you build in so many protections as to make the idea of the "community" irrelevant, the potential is there.
One might also argue that liberal democracy is based on the norms established by the community, but that would be cheating.
This is a marvelous way to attack the concept of law, of course.
Oh, please. Find one of the vast majority of British Muslim women who's staunchly opposed to sharia law and get her to tell you how "voluntary" this stuff is.
Besides, British civil law already allows people to make contracts based on mutually agreed principles, including sharia principles if both parties so choose.
Hitchens is a tool. So is the Archbish.
The commentary at GNXP is, as usual, more reasoned than elsewhere.
I took devolution/decentralization to lengths described as horrific and appalling with regard to abortion here. I'm reading Bruce Benson's "The Enterprise of Law" right now, so I may continue on the subject in the future.
Let's not have anyone cavilling about degrees of voluntariness. The issue of consent to arbitrage is obviously central to what I'm proposing, but it's clear that almost any such arrangement entails a greater degree of voluntary participation than the implied approval of social contract theory. "You were born here" involves zero volition.
I was shouting to my father "Paris, fucking Paris!" but nooo, it had to be Jersey. wtf?
lotsa strands in ole Duder's head with this post. thanks.
let me know when the angry Muslim hordes are lined up on our borders, ok? then I'll worry.
I've got ice to shovel now, thanks.
"You were born here" involves zero volition.
True, but irrelevant. The dear Archbishop's proposal wouldn't get British Muslims out of the "you were born here" social contract requirements--it is about civil law, not about tax law or criminal law or any law based on the social contract ideal.
Also, it's pretty ridiculous to compare involuntary subjection to the state with involuntary subjection to a husband, father or imam. The state isn't all that interested in you personally, since it has so many victims to choose from, and is quite likely to leave you alone to live your life for long periods of time. The state doesn't sleep with you or father your children. At least, not yet.
http://www.johannhari.com/archive/article.php?id=1256
Interesting. Not sure the world is a Neal Stephenson Novel, though (The Diamond Age). This above is another take.
Also, it's pretty ridiculous to compare involuntary subjection to the state with involuntary subjection to a husband, father or imam.
Really? The Patriarchy™? Obviously, dude, you're not a bowler.
It's easy to laugh, Ioz. But...arranged marriages and honor killings are an issue, no? Or, are you saying such are merely part of the propaganda war for our never ending conflict against the duky hordes? Or-can BOTH be true-Islam has some messed up gender dynamics AND said dynamics are emphasized as part of a propaganda campaign by certain "unpleasant" elements of OUR society.
Sadly, although there may be victims of Islamic prudery and control, I doubt the numbers match the death and destruction caused by our Freedom Express.
The Patriarchy™?
Yep. The Patriarchy. It exists, get over it. Especially if you're going to keep whining about a state that probably never even seriously inconveniences you in any way, except as an abstract intellectual entity.
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