
Safford v. Redding is as good an argument as any against universal public education. It shows with humiliating clarity how schools become arms of the Prohibitory state. A public school is a prison for children. Upon entrance, they are categorically deprived of their rights. Rights under the first, second, fourth, and fifth amendments are thoroughly abrogated. Students' speech is censored; they aren't free to assemble; a Swiss Army knife merits explusion; they may be deprived of property, searched without cause, evidence, or provocation. Read the transcript of the Redding arguments and ask yourself when was the last time outside of a prison or jail environment you heard continual references to "contraband."
Any student may be punished, singled out, stripped, humiliated, deprived of rights and privileges, or forced to perform labor based on administrative whim. We have a word for that sort of institution. Prison.
Wednesday, April 22, 2009
Educate and Punish
Labels:
Culture,
Edumacation,
Prison Planet
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43 comments:
When I was 16 I felt exactly this way. Somehow only ten years later I've forgotten. Thanks for reminding me.
I finally realize how those old idiots managed to get so out of touch. They really did just forget.
exactly.
it seems to me that teachers and administrators in this environment are to some degree susceptible to the same transformation seen in the Stanford prison experiment.
at placement time, i find myself requesting that my kids not be placed with a teacher given over to the prison guard mentality.
True story: I got suspended for cheering and shouting my brother's name at an academic awards ceremony. Three days, all because I was proud of my little brother. But they had already tagged me as one of the onetime-overachievers who had long since lost all respect for administration, so I wasn't surprised.
ok, so public schools are prisons. young children have no rights of any kind, and no one hides it.
what does that make private colleges, where young adults who are free to do anything else pay far out the ass to continue their captivity? would that be some sort of mental institution where people check themselves in, out of fear of what would happen if they didn't?
I've spent a lot of time inside prisons (filming). I was struck by how similar the architecture/ layout/ interior design/ all around aesthetics of prisons is to public schools. Walking the "halls" of Angola prison in Louisiana reminded me of my high school. I've always wanted to do a photo series where I take photos (sans people) inside prisons and inside schools then challenge viewers to guess which are which. I doubt they could.
the um, only thing school taught me was how to sit still for eight straight hours at a clip, ignore those around me, snip at those that dare interfere with me and my sphere of reality, take any and all excuses to go to the bathroom to catch a breathe of fresh air or rub one out, all of which is to say that the American education system has helped me tremendously in my career.
this shit really works, folks. it's amazing.
Unfortunately, Mr Fundamental has the long and short of it.
My high school was actually believed to be a prison by people driving by it. Some genius decided that windows distracted the students, so there were virtually no windows.
@Nonny, depends on the private institution. Antioch College, which was mine, was notoriously lax on any kind of administrative oversight into student culture except in the most extreme circumstances. I mean, not everyone got high with their professors while living in an incoherent tent city protest in front of the main building...but there were people who did.
I just overheard this yesterday morning:
"he's not around, have you seen him?"
from across the aisle: "he hasn't been in his cell yet this morning. check the sign out sheet."
"ok, thanks."
Colleges and Universities have their flaws, but they're not prisons. You can come and go as you please and they don't strip search you if they think you have Advil. Some dorms can be a bit much, with over zealous enforcement of underage drinking and drug use, but that's not nearly a prison. Others are completely permissive. I once made mushroom tea in the lounge of a friends college and we didn't think twice about getting caught.
College is also voluntary. Higher education is mostly bogus, too, but if you don't want to sign the honor code, you can leave.
Incidentally, another link between compulsory public education and prison--the rich and well-to-do, for the most part, can opt out.
I went to private Catholic school for much of my upbringing. we just had a better metaphysic.
Parents expect schools to control, protect, discipline, safely transport and oh yeah, educate, their kids for about 8 hours a day so they don't have to. They demand these things of the school, but when, as here, the school acts within the scope of its authority, parents get all in a tizzy, wondering why the school didn't make an exception to the rules for their child. Perhaps parents should wake up and take back responsibility for raising, disciplining, and educating their kids. Maybe they could get to know their kids' teachers, get involved in the school. Then the outrage over strip searches (which btw - I agree is outrageous) would have less of a hollow ring and the Supreme Court would have more respect for parents' and their kids' rights.
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Officer Krupke!
erin4AbsoluteObedience: So..."within the scope of their authority" must mean whatever wacky idea a repressed bureaucrat decided it is? Yeah, right.
'cuz no one likes a fella with a social disease . . .
brian you missed my point entirely and set up a straw man position that I am not arguing
and ioz - huh?
"but when, as here, the school acts within the scope of its authority, parents get all in a tizzy,"
I disagree that I am attacking a strawman. In loco parentis is a somewhat defensible (for the sake of argument) position. Your text implies that the school's decision to act was within the scope of said in loco parentis...and that the parents were somehow wrong to question that. So...the school can basically do whatever it wants and the parents have no right to challenge the administrators.
I disagree with both aspects: that this was within legitimate "in loco parentis" and that the parents have no rights to protest "in a tizzy." Your terminology alone shows where your sympathies lie. As with everything else...with AUTHORITY.
"when i fight authority, authority always wins" john cougar mellancamp
Well thanks for explicating your understanding of my position, but no, that's not what I was arguing. I am arguing that parents have gotten LAZY when it comes to parenting. My "somewhat defensible" point (thanks!) is that parents should be responsible when it comes to raising their children and shouldn't expect schools to do their job. It's fine to for them to get in a tizzy, as long as they realize they had a part in creating the situation. I also describe a means for parents to regain some of that improperly ceded authority.
@Nutella -
"Some dorms can be a bit much, with over zealous enforcement of underage drinking and drug use"
CHUG! CHUG! CHUG!
I see no one has touched on the obvious question that needs to be answered. What the fuck was stuck in Breyer's undies when he was a lad?
I was once a respectable liberal. Now I hang out here.
In between I read Gatto and The Undergroung History of American Education (among other things).
. . . deep down inside us there is good . . . there is good!
deep down inside us there is good...speak for yourself!
-or-
try explaining that one to the emergency room staff.
-or-
there is good in you. the emperor hasn't driven it from you fully...
Fair enough, erin.
erin,
the problem is: saying "parents have gotten lazy" is nostalgia, hero-worship, utter nonsense. parents, in the aggregate, are lazier than they used to be? parents used to be less lazy? when was this?
"[Parents] demand these things of the school, but when, as here, the school acts within the scope of its authority, parents get all in a tizzy, wondering why the school didn't make an exception to the rules for their child."
you'll notice that i carefully exerpted the whole sentence, to emphasize that you were indeed arguing that the school was acting within its authority, IN THIS PARTICULAR INSTANCE ("as here"). no strawman there (which, by the way, is a word that cool people don't use).
further, you ultimately find yourself arguing that, by virtue of sending their child to a school, a parent surrenders, presumably on behalf of the child, any and all of the child's basic human rights. ("My [...] point [...] is that parents should be responsible when it comes to raising their children and shouldn't expect schools to do their job. It's fine to for them to get in a tizzy, as long as they realize they had a part in creating the situation.")
so if this girl's parents were to realize that, because they sent their daughter to a school (isn't it illegal not to?), they bear responsibility for the strip-searching of their minor child, then it would be "fine for them to get in a tizzy". but if they blame the school for a blatant violation of constitutional rights, then they're lazy.
brian somewhat artlessly made a very astute point: you defend authority reflexively, even when you have to contradict yourself to do so.
p.s. if you're advocating home-schooling, you're retarded. or maybe just home-schooled
ERin. What is lazy parenting?
And wasn't this girl who got finger-fucked at school by her administrator while searching for 2 aspirin a straight A student- which usually indicates a pretty active parent? Would this parents hissy fit then be taken seriously?
Hey IOZ, Unqualified Offerings just linked to the cite you're looking for:
"The Role of 'Learned Helplessness' in Torture"
romerocker - I don't know whether her parents were lazy and my argument does not depend on that. The larger point is that we as people (parents included) have ceded enormous power and responsibility on schools for the protection, discipline and rearing of our kids. Then we balk when schools operate like prisons. Do I think schools should have that kind of power and responsibility - clearly not.
And anon - the statistics on homeschooling simply do not bear out your "retarded" comment. (Although I was too lazy and career-obsessed to take on that high calling.)
Whether or not I reflexively defend authority, I am not sure. I simply have a healthy respect for its place in society. And I think a lot of what passes in the land of IOZ for opposition to authority is mostly childish rants not grounded in the reality that we all rely on authority to function in life. To wit (another cool lawyer term), traffic laws that compel a stop at a stop light so we don't get broadsided, or the rule of law that provides a basis for holding those in authority accountable.
And finally, whether I am cool or not, I cannot say, although my teenage daughter's friend told her the other day he thinks I am "pretty chill." So I have that going for me.
Goddamn erin just quit your day job and become a troll. You've already got better material than weev. What's most fascinating about erin is that she always thinks everyone else is the one not getting it. We underfuckingstand. Stop reiterating your point fifteen times a thread, just assume we got the shit and move on.
Now I could be wrong but stopping at a red light is a social decision that can be made without five O rollinz up on my ride. Dang girl ain't you ever driven during a power outage? Cars ain't just willy nilly flying through intersections flipping the bird and shooting missiles at anything in the way. And believe it or not, we don't need authority figures to produce a bunch of red and green LEDs so people know when to hit the break and when to step on the snake. I know. I know. It's hard to wrap your head around such a phenomenon. But try for me erin, cause I think it'd be "super chill".
erin,
you responded mostly to my post-script, and hardly at all to the part where i quoted you in context and mocked you for the absurd beliefs you put forward.
all in all, RESPECT!
-anon
p.s. your daughter's friend is humoring you
Alexi you are so right. Everyone naturally does what's right at all times and respects everyone else's space, especially while driving.
And anon, sorry, I can't defend my position again because you already underfuckingstand. But nice comeback on the homeschooling thing.
Good lord, Alex has a lot of faith in people and their not needing of any rulz.
Anon 12:05: that's some serious douchebaggery but at least it's done anonymously.
Rome,
I'm not saying we don't need traffic lights. I'm saying we can produce them without the state and without state enforcement and they will still work. My b, I can see why you might misinterpret that sentence.
i'm throwin rocks tonight. you guys are dead in the water
Peter's underground history supports the whole ceding of authority and responsibility point I made 15 times over(now 16). And that mandatory, state controlled education is becoming the equivalent of doggy day care for kids. Nony, how many parents do you know who take an active role in educating their kids outside of helping with homework?
Over the past 30 years as a high school principal I watched the Supreme Court constrict student rights in the name of personal safety and/or the goal of protecting the right to an education. As a principal I was told I could censor student publications, search students, deny them the right to express their political and religious views, etc. By the end of my tenure I was frankly shocked at how much authority administrators were given. Remember that the first case on student rights was Tinker vs. Fergusen which declared that "students do not shed their rights at the school house door." We are a long way from that Supreme Court decision which was rendered in the late 60's. What's happened? To call schools prisons certainly gets everyone's attention, but it misses the larger point - Too many schools have come to reflect the worst aspects of contemporary lifem and why wouldn't they? Do we think the kids shed their anger and frustration at the school house door? Like much of society too many schools have become coarse often violent places. Instead of dealing with the root causes of this problem - poverty, alienation, drug addiction, parental neglect, etc. - society demands that schools go into lock down mode. No one would argue that the safety and security of our children is paramount, but in failing to respond to the challenges we face proactively too many parents and administrators are ready to bury their children's fundamental rights in the name of security. But how is this different than society as a whole -after 9/11 we seem ready to shed our own rights as long as the government keeps us safe. I look at the whole situation and am saddened. My thoughts go to Ben Franklin who observed, "Those that would put safety over liberty deserve neither!" It would appear that their are plenty of administrators from the high school to oval offices who are all too willing to oblige. Thank God, some young people are willing to stand up and say - no more!
erin,
thanks for asking. i have several intelligent, maladjusted friends at different stages of their home-schooled lives. forget the parents, do you have any idea how lonely the children get?
incidentally, that link you provided leans pretty fucking heavily on standardized testing, which is a funny thing for a home-schooler to lean on.
once again, this was a small quip placed at the end of a long comment in which i tried to address what was your original, larger point, which was: parents, because they've "gotten lazy", have no right to complain when a school administrator strip-searches their daughter (and that the school was within its rights to do so).
-nony
"To wit (another cool lawyer term), traffic laws that compel a stop at a stop light so we don't get broadsided,"
We are indeed compelled by the law, and the fact that we don't want to get broadsided.Lame, lame example.
The only post here with any value is the high school principal's
Other nony should give his hand a rest.
calmer than you are
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