This is fun. And easy. An anonymous commenter piquefully asks:
Oh, really? Please be so kind as to go to [Rand Paul's] official campaign web site and actually quote just one of the good doctor's "worthwhile causes".Well. Officially, Rand Paul opposes the massive transfer of wealth from private citizens to speculative corporate entitities, is a critic of the Fed and recognizes that "the Federal Reserve, an unelected group of private bankers, is printing trillions of dollars to bail out private industry, purchase government debt, and flood the market with cheap credit." He supports term limits, an admittedly minor but entirely defensible issue, if you're into the whole brevity thing. Finally:
Whether it’s passing the 315 page Patriot Act without a single member of Congress ever reading the bill, proposing a National ID Card, establishing FISA courts and utilizing warrantless searches, or betraying the medical privacy of ordinary citizens, the Federal Government has overstepped its limited powers as stipulated in the Constitution.So, officially, there you have it.
Rand Paul seeks to reassert the rights and privileges of the 50 states and over 300 million Americans. The Federal Government must return to its constitutionally enumerated powers and restore our inalienable rights. Rand proposes that America can successfully protect itself against potential terrorists without sacrificing civil liberties. Rand rejects the premise that the Federal Government must be given a blank check in the name of national security.
America can prosper, preserve personal liberty, and repel national security threats without intruding into the personal lives of its citizens.
Now it is wholly valid to say that Paul doesn't really believe these things, or that his law-and-order, protect-the-borders schtick inherently contradicts his stance on liberty and privacy, or that his appeals to States Rights and localism are coded racism, or that his opposition to the Fed plays opportunistically on prevalent conspiracy-mongering within the so-called Tea-Party movement. You can say that his promises to fight for Constitutional governance are no more believable than Barack Obama's, although you'd have to be a fairly credulous Democratic partisan to go quite that far. The fact remains that the Democratic, "progressive" position is now that an executive-expanding, authoritarian, oligarchic militarist in the actual White House, ruling the actual American empire, is less threatening and somehow less worthy of criticism than a potential junior senator who has made some fairly thoughtless comments about race. Whatever, dears. To be fair, I think it is in fact not a bad thing that there exists so strong a social bias against racially insensitive speech that a few questionable comments elicit a furious, snarling rhetorical fussilade that, say, killing the population of a distant village or arrogating to oneself the power to murder anyone, anywhere does not . . . although obviously the very existence of such powerful social bias also suggests that federal legislation is not necessarily the only means of rectifying or addressing racial inequality. That having been said, and to reiterate once more a point that cannot be made often enough, it is not criticism of Rand Paul or the Tea Party movement to which I object, but rather the plain, blinkered belief of so many levelling the criticsm that it is a gang of disaffected and unhappy crypto-Republican political pseudo-activists who represent a greater problem, a greater evil, and a greater injustice (or potential injustice) than the operations of the bipartisan American hegemon, headed by His Jumpshot Himself.
Well, our little club is used to it. In the same way that a couple of SOI-DISANT conservative commenters enjoy reading our vociferous critique of the American empire and our qualified defenses of Iran's right to exist like any other nation as some kind of abiding approval of Mahmoud Ahmedinejad and the Islamic Republic, so too are we inured to the evident liberal belief that the qualified defense of certain aspects of Rand Paul, or the Tea Partiers, or what have you, represents a secret pining for lynch mobs and segregation.
39 comments:
It's funny, too, how the SOI DISANT progressives get so fired up about defending the state's role, but only and exactly to the borders designated by their EN HAUT DISANT commanders.
Rhetorical heat about the Civil Right Act, with false implications that the Dembo Party did anything but drag its feet on that matter back in the day? Excellent!
Meanwhile, how about nationalizing the banks, the Fed, the school-funding system? Cash Against Clunkers, reconstruction of railways and city centers? Manufacturing toothpaste and green toilet paper and selling it for 1/10th the going corporate rate? Universal public pre-school? Minimum incomes for all? A new WPA?
All as forbidden as anything possibly could be. All dutifully unmentioned, nay uncogitated, by the SOI DISANT statists.
When a liberal candidate has some bad ideas, or makes some unflattering comments, the progressives preach pragmatism and say it's better to take the good with the bad than not take anything at all. "Yes Obama supports the War, but he's against torture, and he's for gay rights, so he's better than the racist Republicans, and he can WIN, unlike Kucinich." But when a libertarian-conservative candidate comes up in the political scene and defends some good ideas, and also some bad ones, they only want to focus on the bad and get pure all of a sudden. It is a sad double standard. Expecting political candidates to be perfect, and always be on the ball, is stupid. Rand Paul is against Wall St. bailouts and an aggressive imperialism? Good. That immediately qualifies him to be IN THE CURRENT SENATE, who are destroying the wealth of the nation because of their stupidity, cowardice, political greed, and narrow sightedness.
the Federal Government has overstepped its limited powers as stipulated in the Constitution.
I'm with him on the Patriot Act until this part, but this is like crying to the ref in a pick-up game.
What he's saying is, "The Federal Government has done something I disagree with and even though its right to do so has been upheld by the courts, I will continue to assert otherwise so that you continue to pay me to tilt at windmills."
Instead of, "The Federal Government just gave a shitload of unchecked power to the Executive because the Legislature is filled with venal, know-nothing morons whose every movement is calculated not to come to the notice of the statist jowly chickenhawk gasbags that fill the airwaves."
And you can't discount the feedback effect of social legislation on social climate, so to say that, since the climate is so racially sensitive now that OBVIOUSLY all the Jim Crow laws would have been repealed organically is begging the question to some degree.
Oh and! The conspiracy mongering has put food on his table since he was a wee tot. So it is probably valid to say that, yes.
Other than that, I concur.
Hey, we got Saturday IOZ! Keep squeaking, Anonymouses!
i'm a black dude and an obama supporter, but i also admire ron paul and was inclined to like jr. based on what i'd heard about him. but closer scrutiny is revealing him to be different from pops in that he's less consistent, a bit of a corporatist shill, and less concerned about civil liberties/militarism than so-called econ liberties.
he'll inveigh against govt spending in nice sounding abstract ways but won't shit about reforming the programs that cost the most like medicare.
[PSA: teabaggers are hypocritical as fuck].
and IOZ, you can persist in making the argument that "obama = cheney" w/r/t to civil liberties, war, etc., but i don't buy that shit either. it's gallingly simplistic, and the items in the bill of particulars that so-called libertarians trot out in making the argument are questionable.
BO's admin is more transparent than his predecessors or any other electable figure, which is something that liberals like me care about. and you don't have the info to support the weak presuppositions that underlie your arguments about his alleged civil liberties abuses and how they compare with those of the Bu$h/Satan admin. we're 1 yr removed from that admin's reign and 1 yr into obama's.
you don't know how far cheney went with the domestic spying program (IMO it's reasonable to infer he went as far as the abuses revealed Church-Committee, which included the targeting of investigative reporters, civil rts leaders, and random leftists), and you don't know how far obama's gone in stopping that shit or changing the administration of the laws you allege obama supported and that you allege continued to allow the same sort of particularized harms as the programs administered by the bush admin.
w/r/t his alleged 'militarism,' you act as though stopping the afghan war immediately would be easy. maybe it would be, i don't fucking know, but there's abt 30 countries involved in that shit and almost every politician in this country supported it so making it obama's baby doesn't seem fair. w/r/t iraq, he's pulling out in a year.
the whole obama=cheney meme rests on a bunch of formalistic fictions and dubious premises and equivalencies. HTH.
You are right Obama is not Cheney. He may actually be worse.
Obama actually strikes me as a pretty weak president, George Bush with Biden instead of Cheney as his VP.
To exaggerate a bit, but not much, saying Obama is a militarist is a bit like saying the receptionist at Goldman Sachs is a capitalist.
He's the spokesman for the empire, nothing more.
Saying that until we reverse the bipartisan consenus on militarism, we can't criticize racist politicians like Rand Paul is a bit ridiculous.
Yeah, so we had to tolerate Bilbo and Rankin in the 1940s and 1950s because Truman dropped the bomb on Japan.
And George Wallace really really really didn't kill as many people as Johnson so damn that liberal media for demanding and end to Jim Crow.
And so on.
“BO's admin is more transparent than his predecessors or any other electable figure, which is something that liberals like me care about. and you don't have the info to support the weak presuppositions that underlie your arguments about his alleged civil liberties abuses...” -Anon
Hello friend, you appear to be lost so here’s a map to help you find your way...
You’re welcome.
Mousse-oh-so-sure,
You do me great honor, and it appears my pique actually got you to read the Good Doctor's campaign web site. Well done. Let's take a look at these "worthwhile causes":
Verily, Dr. Rand is a veritable fountainhead of ideas...the bailouts are a massive transfer to the wealthy, the federal government has gotten a bit carried away wrt "homeland security", and he has discovered that the Fed is a bit secretive. Bully. I agree, sir IOZ, and in my abject defeat hereby offer my sword. If I am ever in Pittsburgh, I'd be glad to spot you a beer or as many as you care to imbibe in one sitting. We can find an out of the way place I'm sure where you will not be embarrassed to be seen in the company of a "prowggie".
But, but, but.... this is the intertubes, and it is not good form to slink away in utter defeat and humiliation (and I am anonymous, because I am a log-on klutz).
In this regard it strikes me as reasonable to inquire as to the context of the Good Doctor's analysis. You'll pardon me if I find this lacking.
With all due respect, I sincerely hope that you do not share his prescriptions:
Balanced budget fetishism--a truly bad idea in a recession that favors the very class he so roundly condemns for er, appropriating the bailouts.
Paying down the national debt--are you serious?
Strengthening the dollar--another economically suicidal policy.
Federal over-reach in the context of standard and still stale stale "states rights" code...coupled with a curious failure to mention the institutional relationships that provide the seedbed for this tyranny. One searches in vain for the Good Doctor referencing Empire, for example.
The secretive fed? Wow. You really nailed my ass there, IOZ. That is old time religion among glibertarians and wingnuts. What next? Dr. Paul avers the 16th Amendment was never actually "passed"? The Rothschilds control world finance? We must return to the gold standard?.....the usual John Birch Society paranoid right wing cant. By golly, those Birchers have "admirable ideas" too, wouldn't you agree? (Just say yes to salve my wounded ego-just a little).
Is this the standard that we are to apply to the heft of ideas in the "marketplace", and the veracity of their proponents? Well, if that is the case, you've got me. Big Time.
One cannot dispute that a stopped clock displays the correct time twice a day. You seem to find this of some importance. To my thinking it is more important to understand that it is a stretch to conclude from that fact that it is a good clock.
What's that MR. FUNDAMENTAL say? BLAWWWWG ON*....
*just what the fuck is that about, anyway?
--Donny (the clueless one)
How is Obama's more transparent than any other administration? I mean, I remember this as a campaign promise (I remember a lot of campaign promises) but I don't know what's actually being done in that regard that makes you so confident?
Especially with the whole threatening-to-throw-gov't-whistleblowers-in-prison thing.
The secretive fed? Wow. You really nailed my ass there.... That is old time religion among glibertarians and wingnuts.--Anon 9:18
And that proves it's false. Period.
By the way (***I make no assumptions about who does or does not hold any opinions represented herein, either bloggers above or Rand Paul or any other person living or dead***), even if one thinks the bankers who run the Fed are freedom-for-the-masses-loving altruistic democrats why advocate an economic regime that is suicidal, if not malign--what does one think is going to happen when we can't pay the interest on the National Debt (the principle itself is obviously unpayable)? Austerity time! (austerity is knocking on the door for manifold other reasons, this is just one example) Instead of a federal income tax to pay debt to owed a private bank (the Fed) the government should create money directly, invest in things people actually need and use the profit created by public industry in leu of taxes.
I leave you with this quote, from the conspiracy-mongering film by Tom Tykwer, "the International" --
You control debt, you control everything.
"And that proves it's false."
What is "it"?
"..what does one think is going to happen when we can't pay the interest on the National Debt (the principle itself is obviously unpayable)?"
A sovereign state that issues its own fiat currency and allows it to freely float against other currencies is not financially constrained.
"Austerity time!"
That is a political constraint, not a "financial" one.
From RonPaulForums.com: "Say what you want about LaRouche but he's on our side on a lot of issues...
September 3, 2009 (LPAC)—Lyndon LaRouche today forcefully warned that any effort to cover up the crimes committed by the Federal Reserve Bank, during the Bush and Obama administrations, will be "tantamount to treason.""
Who'da thought! Lyndon LaRouche has "worthwhile causes", too!!!!!
--Donny
politicians. power seekers. even if one should say a right thing, it is pure folly to believe they will necessarily put the force of whatever power they accumulate behind it. they will act, use power, only in ways that will increase their own power.
Rand Paul will cast the occasional symbolic, but ultimately ineffective, vote in favor of stemming the transfer of wealth from private citizens to corporate interests, or whatever. but there's as much chance he will succeed in ending the war on drugs, or imperial foreign policy (or turn back the CRA!) as there is of Obama, as president and commander of the biggest fucking death machine in the world, even attempting to undo the patriot act, military tribunal act, or FISA. or to end secret prisons, or torture as an instrument of state power, or marking people for assassination just cause he said so, or...
politicians: Don’t believe them, don’t fear them, don’t ask anything of them.
It is hard to tell who or what your responding to with this post. You are starting to sound like a smart version of CF Oxtrot, hallucinating pwoggishness where there isn't any.
I think that very few of the serious commenters involved in discussion with you since your first post on this topic dispute that Obama is the most dangerous man in the world, including, most likely, the person who asked you to find something of value on Paul's web site.
Most of the heat when this first started was generated by your glib assessment of the Civil Rights Act and when it came around to Paul, the assertion that he could potentially do more for black people than cruise missile liberals by way of an assumed libertarian opposition to perpetual war and drug laws.
I don't think most of the folks commenting here disagree on the evil of cruise missile liberals nor is there any evidence that anyone saw your post as a full-throated endorsement of Paul. You were taken to task mostly for over- crediting Paul with sincere, classically libertarian opposition to war and drugs laws and the notion that by virtue of these he could actually have some small positive effect on the way things are.
It is interesting that in your search for merit on the Rand Paul web site, you didn't find anything about drugs or ending the wars. The examples you trotted out are interesting, but they don't seem to fortify your original position with respect to how Paul could improve things for black folks.
You were taken to task mostly for over- crediting Paul with sincere, classically libertarian opposition to war and drugs laws and the notion that by virtue of these he could actually have some small positive effect on the way things are.
Like I said, Paul le jeune seems like some kind of retarded android leftover from the back lot of some unfilmed Star Trek franchise. He manages to cough out one interesting point, which must have been accidental, because he promptly manages to forget to follow up on it. He says, "Hey, we've had a lot of re-segregation."
CONNECT IT.
Transparent? This is the president who is breaking records for avoiding live televised questions, and who took a look at the classified torture photos and refiled them under Eyes Only.
Anybody who meant 10 percent of what this nightmare on stilts claimed he stood for during his (marketing) campaign would have published the photos and used them as proof that both current wars are unspeakable crimes.
Fundamental:
A libertarian who hates Black people, thinks they are racially and genetically inferior, and would, given the opportunity, refuse to serve racial minorities at his own business could nevertheless be better for Blacks than any cruise missile liberal. Ending the drug war and closing prisons and not sending poor Black people to die in crazy foreign adventures based on hazy "humanitarian" principles is more important than paying lip service to the Civil Rights office at the DOJ.
CONNECT IT
since ya'll are such dedicated, um, detractors (detractors get me hot), I was thinking you could do the ground work - work that I'd usually ask the intern at my office to do (why do we lay off 6 people and still hire interns?) - and google the um, residency and voter registration requirements for the state of Kentucky. much obliged, as they might say in Luhlville. haha. . .Luhlville. go fucking figure!
I can't wait until next election, when Sarah Palin coughs up an interesting point, by accident.
Empire should be capitalized. It make it seem that much more official.
I'm a tard who can't log in is why. By the way, questioning the virtue of the Fed equals being a Larouchie.
--Donny
It is hard to tell who or what your [sic] responding to with this post.
Ahahaha. Really?! Blockquote. Exit, pursued by bear.
An Ominous Black Dude seems to have mistaken the shiny, opaque polish of the new WH lawn-ornament for a crystal. Hint: That image you see is a reflection (apparently it's not just the teleprompter employing one-way glass?)
And as a preemptive disclaimer (for the Speck in the split-pea gallergroolia incapable of contrasting, comparing, or keeping an eye on the prize), I'd like to present a list of all who can figuratively blow me:
(in alpha-animus order, lest ye tink I'm playin' faves)
Bo Rama, Dick Bush, Ray Cyst, Ray Madcow, Moe Foab, Mo Bidin, Kush Limb-ball, Hills Ramrod Bubba von Hope XLII, George Willfully Simpleton, Georg Staphylokokkeninfektion, Kokett Handjobberts, Demo Cretin, Republik Conner, Indie Pendant, Libby Terrier Wanntanabe, Nan Puhl Easy, and, yes, even Ayn Paul can commence to suckin' on it (or not, as we be free), but A. Nonnie Mousse, you gonna haft get in line.
God IOZ. You're like so witty and snarky and cool.
And I hate liberals so much and it's like really so funny when you call them Pwogs and they get all mad and stuff.
I mean it's not like I really believe anything or anything because I hate Republicans as much as I hate Democrats I just defend Republicans to get Democrats mad.
But damn. You're so funny and shit.
Shut the fuck up, Dononymous.
IOZ's initial statement about racism and libertarian positions was written in the conditional, and follows an expression of doubt that Paul is either of these things. He has since tried to make this more clear, but evidently its not getting through. Anon, 1:01, Donny, and the rest: IOZ's ARGUMENT IS HYPOTHETICAL.
All you Liberal Frank Gaffney wannabe's are simply misreading this statement because you don't like the fact that IOZ's argument is obviously true and obligates an intellectually honest person to revisit their allegiances.
Either learn to fucking read, or find some fucking dignity and give us a reason to think that the moral equality we theoretically grant you is in fact deserved.
God it's so fucking funny when you post this shit.
Like I was saying to my mom when she came down to the basement to bring me my fifth of Jack and Coke while I was watching KE$HA's newest video and I'm like this IOZ is such a rebel and I want to go out and like bring down the state or something and my mom just said his picture makes him look like George Washington.
So you have no frame of reference here, Nonny.
You're implying that a group composed entirely of females will...breed?
No. I'm just saying . . . life . . . will find . . . a way.
what La Rana said is where i was heading in my prior comment although i never quite brought it home at the end. what a politician says in the pursuit of power is meaningless as it pertains to what they will do in the pursuit of power. as i read IOZ, his was to say, 'interesting what Paul feinted in the direction of saying.' then broadened the concept out to the HYPOTHETICAL la Rana mentioned.
the regulars round here, "our little club," are generally against the kind of power the empire flexes. so the argument that the civil rights act enfranchised more black voters begs some kind of question as to the value of being allowed to participate in electoral politics here. something many of us have rejected. what good is enfranchisement to the alienated?
the more interesting question to me has to do with this alienation and powerlessness, not necessarily race. to look at race and say blacks are underrepresented among the elite or overrepresented among the alienated, is evidence of the nature of the power structures that rule us. institutional racism is odious, but even more odious is supporting s system in which so many people are kept in a state of having little freedom to live life as they choose.
I may not succeed, but let me try to turn down the heat. Let us take IOZ's final sentence and change a few words:
"so too are we (tortured prowggies) inured to the evident (IOZ club) belief that the qualified defense of certain aspects of (prowggie politics), or the (current president), or what have you, represents a secret pining for (the all intrusive security state) and (endless wars to turn countries populated by mostly brown peoples into dust).
I take it this modified version is "intellectually untenable" since it does not lead me to revisit my (unstated)"allegiances".
Thank you for your reply.
Now back to the end of Davidly's line. Gosh. Why does it have to be such a long one?
--Donny
It is hard to tell who or what your [sic] responding to with this post.
Ahahaha. Really?! Blockquote. Exit, pursued by bear.
These replies must have one purpose only and that's to impress your retarded mini-Mes Fundamental and Oxtrot.
Yeah, I saw the blockquote. But then you go onto one of your little tirades that implies a response to views the original poster did not suggest.
You keep insisting that all you really said and what all of us are too thick to understand is that Rand Paul's views on race regardless of what they are are insignificant in comparison to the crimes of Obama and co. But if you'd actually said that, no one would have argued with you.
Everyone else seems to understand it just fine, which is why they keep telling you that you're out of your element. Your homework tonight is to look up the expression "all of us."
I've seen a lot of spinals, Dude, and this guy is a fake. A fucking goldbricker.
12:07 AM Nonny: "goo goo goo goo goo goo goo IOZIHATEYOU goo goo goo goo goo goo OXTROTGETSUNDERMYSKIN goo goo goo goo goo goo goo DONTCALLMEAPWOG goo goo goo goo goo ILOVEOBAMABUTWONTADMITIT goo goo goo goo goo goo."
Baby talk!
Clearly you are all forgetting that none of this matters to Jesus.
Hey, IOZ, did you ever notice that nihilists in TBL were the most ridiculous characters? Funny that, a movie all about how pretty much every ethos is stupid and yet one is chosen to be the stupidest. Well, maybe it was a tie with Walter? Naw, at least Walter had some loyalty and knew how to stand up for himself.
IT'S NOT FAIR.
they were nihilists, Dude?
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