Tuesday, September 13, 2011

Fayette Nam

Although the inquiry stems from a fundamental misreading of everything ever written on this blog, the question is worth a brief answer: why am I interested in Ron Paul?  Well, I am not interested in Ron Paul per se.  I mean, I did call him a stooge and say that ersatz intellectual diversity superimposed on the public facade of the ruling class is an affect overlying an underlying unanimity among the actually powerful.  What I am interested in is the fact that Ron Paul has a constituency.  I am interested in the fact that a statistically meaningful portion of the adult voting population of the Benighted Apes of Duh-merica is unabashedly in favor of ending the war on drugs and military adventurism abroad, of a substantial and meaningful devolution of centralized federal power--and not merely the window-dressing smallgovernment yibyab of the Republican Party, but far more fundamental limits on the government, including its warmaking apparatus.  Now I don't disagree that this is not gonna be part of the program, not even if well-timed asteroid strikes eliminate every other candidate and Barack Obama is finally proven to be the immortal incarnation of Jomo Kenyata; I mean, obviously.  How often have I harped on the institutional nature of power, especially political power in an empire?  But what you hear, over and over, is that the middle of this country is chock full o nuts, that it is wholly populated by a gang of Caucasian homophobes who wish to instate executions for parking violations and invade those few uninvaded parts of the world that remain in order to establish an eternal Bachmanate of the Palin, and while that may be to a degree true, it is also true that, literallyjoebiden, millions and millions of people believe quite the opposite, that there are millions of fat white nativists who despite their abhorrent views on immigration also believe that America ought to end the drug war.  You are of course, free to argue that Paul's nativist supporters tolerate the legalization of heroin as a charming quirk of a man whose real appeal is his view on the Fed, but you will be wrong.  I grew up with these people in Appalachian Pennsylvania and your collegeboy convictions that a couple Fox News whoopsters in the back of a televised debate represent their degraded humanity is wrong and only indicative of your own insular life; most people haven't got the luxury of your imagined political coherency, and the fact that Ron Paul's popular rhetoric of liberty coexists with an uncomfortable fixation or borders, or that his beliefs about government intrusion into private life sit oddly against his positions on abortion--well, these things might in fact represent (I use that word intentionally) the unsettled nature of his supporters' convictions.

The Tea Party itself is a construct, and Ron Paul is mind control, and I am not interested in either of them in and of themselves; yet there are millions on millions whose human conscience is offended by war, surveillance, prohibition, and coercion.  A lot of them simply don't vote; many who do get suckered by the Paul Pill.  But their conscience remains.

56 comments:

Professor Coldheart said...

I grew up with these people in Appalachian Pennsylvania

I grew up with them in Appalachian Maryland, dude, and I ain't seeing it.

James N. said...

Some people in an audience did something revolting.

A bunch of pundits were revolted.

You wrote that the revolting actions were, I don't know, some secret Democratic Party plot to discredit Flyover Americans.

Now that people pointed out this is silly thing to believe, you're claiming Flyover Americans aren't revolting.

Man, ain't nobody claiming Flyover Americans are revolting - or at least, no more revolting than Americans at large. Whitman contains multitudes, and so does Buck Mulligan.

We're saying it's sick as hell to cheer when somebody dies because he can't afford insurance. Nobody worth paying attention to is claiming this is anything more than an identifiable, disgusting component of the Republican base. Given the last ten years, its existence is hardly news, yet neither can it be credibly denied.

(It should go without saying that other parties have their own disgusting elements, though as a thirty-something without health insurance, I'm a little more sensitized to this particular bunch.)

Karl Franz Ochstradt said...

BOO!

skay-uh-whee Tee Party Urs!

I suppose the plan is to murder everyone who doesn't agree 100% with what I want, think or say.

Therefore, a difference of opinion, or worse -- a lack of political sophistication leading to parroting a dimbulb talking head -- this, my friends, is the purest evidence of a need to commit purging mass murders!

Why help them see what they have in common with you?

Why let them help you see what you have in common with them?

So much easier to see a shortfall in meeting that 100% identity, and thereby decree a need for a mass slaughter!

Kill 'em all! Especially the ones who say they admire Glenn Beck!

Gabe Ruth said...

This was beautiful. I knew you weren't really a nihilist.

I would go further. Assuming the heartland caricature were accurate, considering the sacrosanct nature of "democracy" and the component of the caricature involving demographics, it would behoove liberals to at least begin weakening the state apparatus before the Christian barbarians at the gate take over and toss the indigent into the street while invading the world for real.

One wonders what the ratio is between the cynical and the deluded among our masters.

Leonard said...

James N, you're saying that at some political event a bunch of Republicans cheered when they heard that somebody died? When was this? And who, exactly, died?

Could it be that the issues at stake were a little more complex than you are making out?

Anonymous said...

"Conscience"??

Snort.

IOZ said...

A democratic party plot? There is no democratic party. But a plot, yes. Or do you think they raffled off those tix?

James N. said...

Leonard, what's your characterization of those shouts of "yeah"?

fish said...

If the cheering were really embarrassing to power instead of serving power, it would not be plastered all over the news today.

Mr.Fundamental said...

is it being prepared to do the right thing? whatever the cost? isn't that what makes a man?

Christopher M. said...

Dude, support for one of the wrestling monkeys in the quadrennial monkey-match does not equal support for every single one of that monkey's policy positions. Support for Ron Paul does not equal support for the dismantling of the drug war any more than support for Obama '08 equaled support for a multi-billion-dollar mandates-and-subsidies scheme to funnel mountains of cash into the insurance industry. If you're going to claim that the presence of a statistically significant base of support for Ron Paul in the Republican primaries indicates the existence of millions and millions of registered Republicans - or, fuck, Americans of any kind - who advocate the dismantling of the empire, the end of the prison state and the decriminalization of heroin, you need to show your fucking work.

And while your oddball ad-homs are welcome as always ("college boy"? Really? I guess "Oberlin" was just the name of the farm you grew up on when you were hanging out with the peasants and the proletarians), no one has brought up cultural stereotypes besides you. It was city-dwelling liberals who gushed over Clinton's crime bill, who elected and re-elected Giuliani and Bloomberg, who have sat in prim silence as Obama continues and expands upon all of Bush's atrocities. Authoritarian systems attempt to condition everyone living under their control to accept the legitimacy of that control. What exactly makes you think these particular supporters of this particular dupe are the exception to the rule?

James N. said...

Man, Ron Paul kidnapped himself!

Mr.Fundamental said...

R.I.C.E. is the prescription I would suggest Christopher M., as I believe you just pulled a muscle.

"Tea Partiers aren't real! they're not coherent! neither are you! this is all nonsense! nonsentia! nonsentience!"

"oh yes they are real, just look at them!"

Anonymous said...

You have to admit if George Washington came back to life armed with an M16 and came upon one of the GOP debates, Ron Paul would be the only person he'd leave alive.

Leonard said...

James:

Oh, at the t-party debate? Those shouts (not cheers) are people shouting "Yeah", meaning: "society" (that is, the state) should let a man die (within a hypothetical scenario where he bought no insurance and there was no provision for this situation in the law and nobody else in all of that "society" was willing to shoulder the cost voluntarily).

I think any libertarian would say the same, if you really did manage to construct the medical equivalent of a lifeboat scenario. (I would.) But I think most would resist Blitzer's (and your) idea that any real human society would operate in such terms. You fail to understand compassion and charity. To you if "society" (by which of course you mean the state) does not do something, it does not get done.

Note that Ron Paul, who actually does know something about medical practice in a society without socialized medicine, explicitly rejects the hypothetical. ("We never turned anybody away...") Of course, his response does not appear in your clip. Your allies at "tpmtv" cut it. Inconvenient, a doctor's insight into the actual practice of private medicine.

mistah charley, ph.d. said...

did you know there are a couple of new posts at fafblog?

Inkberrow said...

Fish---

The cheering was neither embarrassing to power nor serving power. It was Speaking Truth to Power. Let's all stop pretending that a cradle-to-grave social safety net is even worth lip service any more. It's the Asian Century. Think of compassion and social obligations as they do China, not France.

NutellaonToast said...

So you're interested in the fact that blatantly shallow stereotypes of large swaths of people aren't 100% correct? As a rule then, or just in this instance or...?

For fuck's sake, IOZ, start your essay again from "But what you hear over and over" and just replace your conservative stereotypes with liberals ones and your middle of the continent locations with coastal ones and you get the same fucking thing. There are also millions and millions of ostensible democrats that are anti-war and anti-drug prohibition that are just too stupid to realize that democrats will never do that (Yea, me two years ago, fine. You used to be a libertarian, so we're even.)

You don't identify with them for the reason you say you do. Figure out the real one. It will be good for you.

James N. said...

Leonard wrote:
those shouts (not cheers) are people shouting "Yeah", meaning: "society" (that is, the state) should let a man die (within a hypothetical scenario where he bought no insurance

You got me, Leonard! The verb "cheered" completely mischaracterizes their view of the state's role in providing healthcare to the indigent.

Leonard said...

Yes it does. Glad you see it too.

Anonymous said...

speaking of hypothetical killings, i'd cheer if someone was somehow able to murder TV. or even all tv personalities (except glen back, ha ha -- oh wait, he's not on tv anymore).

Anonymous said...

Anyone who doesn't think a monopoly agency of force should appropriate funds under threat of force to provide a whole range of goods and services to large numbers of people who may or may not actually be capable of acquiring them on their own or through other less coercive channels is an immoral fascist evil person.

Anonymous said...

NUTTY TOAST - "There are also millions and millions of ostensible democrats that are anti-war and anti-drug prohibition that are just too stupid to realize that democrats will never do that"

For fucks sake, lily-livered democrats were scared to throw support behind Kucinich (or Nader), because _last_ election was too important. Aren't they all!

Democrats love democracy and are obsessed with fixing shit. Like that poor fellow who didn't insure himself. There's not an anti-authoritarian strain left for the modern left.

IOZ said...

I think it is interesting that so many of the saw-dees-aunts lefties who hang out around here rush with such alacrity to assure us that, yes, hoi polloi are the problem. Little bitches are all one mugging away from signing up for the Charles Murray newsletter and locking the car doors when they drive in one of those neighborhoods. MIND IF WE DANCE WITH YO DATES?

Jack Crow said...

When the push finally comes into its own as a putsch - if it ever does - it's the "small business man" who will gladly stomp some faggot heads in the name of Jeebus.

I don't know if the conditions for actual, historical fascism will ever manifest north of the Rio Grande, because frankly fascism is an emergency reaction by capital to capital's loss of political control, but it won't be wearing NASCAR ball caps if it comes.

All that said, the Tea Party is the demographic most representative of the "small business man," and that surface anti-government rhetoric masks a considerable devotion to a very martial and corporate authority.

Paul Alexander said...

Fuck yeah they're little bitches! Helping the lower class sounds good on paper until they see them watching Maury and throwing their soda cans on the ground. "Why they don't care about the environment at all! And when I asked them to move over so I could sit down, they gave me a dirty look and turned up their hippity hoppity music. I bet they don't even know about Frantz Fanon!"

IOZ said...

Black Skin, White Readership.

CMike said...

[IOZ, for all of us unworthies out here who are your base, how about including some gratuitous paragraph breaks every ten lines or so when you post?]

NutellaonToast said...

Nony - I agree. Nor the right. Specially not the Tea Party

IOZ - IOZ, if you mean me, I have no fucking idea what you're talking about.

All I want to know is why you only like the "millions on millions whose human conscience is offended by war, surveillance, prohibition, and coercion. A lot of them simply don't vote; many who do get suckered by the Paul Pill. But their conscience remains." who foolishly align with the right instead of the same faction who stupidly marches with the left?

Let me make it clear, since past me would say otherwise, I defend neither. They're both liars. Almost everyone want to prohibit, surveil, coerce or kill some way or another. It's just a question of on what principle they will base it. I give no kudos to someone just cause that principle isn't the government of the USA.

IOZ said...

They're gonna prohibit, surveil, coerce or kill some way or another that poor woman!

NutellaonToast said...

Naw, seriously, bra. What's the dif?

HM said...

unabashedly?

That's not my read. I am pretty sure the bulk of Paul constituents are quite abashed with him (to write in your style).

btw, are you backing away from your recent claim the media was quite right to not mention when Paul won debates and polls, because he was not electable (one of the most dubious things you have ever posted, and I have been a fan for years)? I mean, since making that claim you have have been mentioning him. Guilt? ...can you at least admit he is more human than the vampires and vultures and con-artists that fill DC?

James N. said...

All the Dude ever wanted was to not have to depend on Leonard's sense of charity for basic healthcare needs.

Apparently that means I hate everyone you grew up with. I mean, I'm Eastern PA, so I guess I do anyway. But I still think that's a lucky guess.

Michael J Smith said...

Very, very good stuff, Monseigneur. People's attitudes *are* self-contradictory. And quite right, too.

Jack Crow said...

HM,

Without attributing intelligence to accident, being "more human" to a set of the population is Paul's function. Perhaps unwillingly (though I doubt it, since he's a successful campaigner for his perennial House seat), the man is a gatekeeper.

Cüneyt said...

IOZ, most of the Appalachians I grew up with were about as libertarian as the liberal shits I went to college with were anti-war. That's just my experience, though. There have been a few that fit your description, so I really hope you're right. I've seen nothing but McNamaras and McCarthys for a while, so I'm fucking jaded.

Anonymous said...

@JamesN
So you're telling me - if I don't pony up the dough to Uncle Sam, granpa gets it?

Capt'n Obvious

jcapan said...

"Helping the lower class sounds good on paper until they see them watching Maury and throwing their soda cans on the ground."

Wasn't that what Steinbeck said before he decided against writing Grapes of Wrath?

Rojo said...

My experience, having lived in mid-Hudson Valley, NY; Austin, TX; and Portland, OR; and traveled around large parts of the country, including among my Appalachian relatives in Kentucky, is that most people have two selves. They have their partisan/tribal selves and then they have their policy selves. People's policy selves tend to be far more rational than their partisan/tribal selves.

Reminds me a bit of the story told to me by one of my friends of the Semitic persuasion about the time he broke down in WV. As the part of the car he needed was not arriving for at least a day, he got invited to stay at someone's house for the night. Over dinner, he was asked to say grace and declined, stating that he was Jewish. The family stared at him like he was an alien, and the patriarch asked him, "Well, where are your horns?" After explaining that Jews don't actually have horns, the patriarch said, "Huh! Alright then, I guess I'll say grace," and the friend reports that the he was still treated like an honored guest for the rest of his stay there.

People, once you get them talking about things beyond their tribal identifications, are often quite reasonable, I find. But perhaps I'm biased because as the product of a Dothead Hindu mother and a Honky Southern Baptist father I'm preconditioned to reject tribal identifications (although both the parents still strongly identify with the Democratic Party, much to my continued chagrin and mystification).

Christopher M. said...

yes, hoi polloi are the problem. Little bitches are all one mugging away from signing up for the Charles Murray newsletter and locking the car doors when they drive in one of those neighborhoods. MIND IF WE DANCE WITH YO DATES?

Have fun torching that strawman! In the meantime, all I've suggested is that radical anti-authoritarian sentiment is not terribly widespread in this particular authoritarian state - either among the liberals you happily hold in contempt, or among the soi-disant libertarians for whom you seem to hold some misplaced nostalgic fondness.

Anonymous said...

Why doesn't IOZ hate everyone equally?? The progressive ethos of complete equality at all costs demands it!

Christopher M. said...

I don't give a shit about who IOZ decides to hate. But he's drawing frankly laughable conclusions about the Great and Noble American Conscience based on the following of a single political huckster. You might as well say there's millions of devoted anti-war liberals based on the number of people who bought Howard Dean bumper stickers.

IOZ said...

Lulz. I just thought I would swing by the comments section of this blog I don't regularly read to inform all of you in no uncertain terms that I have never been here and have no interest in anything any of you might ever have said, which, if I had read it, I would know with certainty to be totally wrong. Idiots.

James N. said...

Chris, don't you get it? IOZ knows a guy.

Peter Ward said...

My recent experience of jury duty gave me cause for hope: the hysterical laughter at the propaganda video on how the Western world was a brutal tyranny of barbarian hordes until the Colonists dumped tea in the water and...whatever-juries rock! hosted by Diane Sawyer and the white-friendly back dude also from 60 Minuteline. But also the general contempt my peers showed toward the court aparatus and its affected decorum was quite heartwarming.

Brian M said...

Peter Ward: Have you ever heard Montreal "anarchist" sound collective Godspeed You Black Emperor's sound piece in which they recorded this "Street Poet's" rant about paying his parking ticket? Pretty funny.
Can't remember the album, though

Sorry said...

That was real nice, man.

Anonymous said...

because frankly fascism is an emergency reaction by capital to capital's loss of political control,

I'm afraid you'll have to reread your Seymour Martin Lipset, JC.

His classic conclusion (fascism is the result of the petite bourgeoisie being squeezed between labor and plutocrats) virtually predicts the rise of the Tea Party in the US.

Lipset may have been a Dahl-style 20th century apologist for the USA, but in this case, he was dead-on

Jack Crow said...

Anonymous,

Can't reread what I've never read. I don't really care about "classic conclusions," anyway. Especially ones which assume that labor had any strength with which to squeeze up against the small holders in Italy, Portugal, Germany and Spain.

At the core of each actually fascist movement were capitalists (not petite bourgeoisie) in cooperation with monarchists (Italy, Spain) and/or aristocratic restorationists (Portugal, Prussia, Bavaria).

The fascist parties which actually seized states may have relied on small holders for cadre, vote sanctifiers and prison guards but the movements were firmly in the hands up people quite willing to do business with Fiat and Krupp.

demize! said...

There is a sizable "minarchist" libertarian, old line conservative faction that detest cops. Most of the anti police abuse blogs, work, going on of any substance seems to be coming from the nominal right. If thats not fodder for some coalition building I don't know what is

demize! said...

Jack Crow said... HM, Without attributing intelligence to accident, being "more human" to a set of the population is Paul's function. Perhaps unwillingly (though I doubt it, since he's a successful campaigner for his perennial House seat), the man is a gatekeeper.
THIS! With all the talk of dismantling The Federal Reserve, if he were in earnest, I can only assume he'd be, you know, dead.

Anonymous said...

Why does IOZ, along with the rest of the commenters, assume that those who cheered the idea of letting the man die were "hoi polloi"? Why don't you assume, as I do, that right-wing blowhards tend to be pretty well off, pretty highly educated, bankers, lawyers, business owners and mangers, physicians...

I can't really be the only one that didn't assume that the cheering ones were working class. But along with his critiics, IOZ did, IOZ simply took the other tack, that the cheerers were righteous and justified as trenchant libertarian rebels against the leviathan of state power. But his anti-working class bias in assuming those cheering were "hoi polloi" was just as blatant as those who denounced their cheering as being the act of backwoods rednecks.

But I know my right-wing blowhards. They have money, nice cars, nice houses, fancy degrees. Doesn't stop them from being loudmouthed assholes. Rather it encourages them, gives them the certainty of their superiority.

Anonymous said...

"Especially ones which assume that labor had any strength with which to squeeze up against the small holders in Italy, Portugal, Germany and Spain."

So you really think that the small-holders in the Weimar were not at least partially terrified into the arms of the brownshirts by the demonstrable "street power" of labor?

If so, forget about Lipset. Many observers have claimed that the small-holders were in fact more scared of the Left than of Hitler, so they opted for the lesser of their fears.

Jack Crow said...

If Germany is your only example, it still doesn't account for the relative failure of the German socialists to present a credible threat to capital; the theory that the PB were scared into supporting the brownshirts also elides the fact the most Germans were not, as is the case with all fascisms, members of the party which seized the state. Being subject to that state is not the same as being the driving force behind historical fascism, Anonymous.

Jack Crow said...

...which isn't to suggest that the demographic most likely to support a fascist reaction isn't the petite bourgeoisie. They are. They just aren't what drives fascism, or the subclass which benefits from it.

Enron said...

Crackers be crackin', yo